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Tue, 12/13/2011 - 11:08am


Comments

 
Mon, 12/12/2011 - 11:03am
Dankrupt Says:

http://deepgreenresistance.org Get involved if you are not the militant type. No matter what your skills are, you can be useful.
"I need to be clear that it’s not up to all of us to dismantle the system. Not all of us need to take down dams, factories, electrical infrastructures. Some of us need to file timber sale appeals, some need to file lawsuits. Some need to work on rape crisis hot lines, and some need to work at battered women’s shelters. Some need to help family farmers or work on other sustainable agriculture issues. Some need to work on fair trade, and some need to work on stopping international trade altogether. Some need to work on decreasing birth rates among the industrialized, and some need to give all the love and support they can to children (I’ve heard it said that the most revolutionary thing any of us can do is raise a loving child).

One of the good things about everything being so fucked up—about the culture being so ubiquitously destructive—is that no matter where you look—no matter what your gifts, no matter where your heart lies—there’s good and desperately important work to be done. Know explosives? Take out a dam. Know how to love and accept children, how to teach them to love themselves, to think and feel for themselves? That’s what you need to do." - Derrick Jensen
If you do decide to go the militant route though, keep security culture at the front of your mind. I cannot stress enough how important it is.

 
 
Sat, 01/14/2012 - 1:26am

The cancer quote in the end (of the highdea)
the only thing that popped in my head was
"If I had cancer I would smoke weed".
That is the truth right there.
Society is that cancer, so society needs to smoke weed.

 
 
Tue, 01/17/2012 - 9:05pm
Destiny13 Says:

The very name of the site has me scared to go to it as of now.
Not that it's not amazingly awesome and wonderful, because I can tell it *is*.
It's just that anyone involved in any militant or militia type stuff is harassed by the powers that be, to no end.
Kids are "legally" ripped from families, and given to families who abuse them and only do it for the $1000 monthly they get paid to foster each one..
Obama signed the National Defense Authorization Act of 2012, which allows, not suggests, but allows, the detaining of American citizens without charges, trial, or any of that "due process" goodness. We can be sent to offshore torture camps, with no word. Just kidnapping people No shit.
I'm not racist. Quite the opposite, but Obama sucks.
If any black man were to be president that I know of I would have wanted Tupac. lol
OR I had an awe inspiring friend on facebook once. Thise guy was genius. I think his name was William something.
I closed my facebook, but I would have loved to meet that dude.
He just randomly friended me from seemingly out of no where and it was a delight knowing the guy, and seeing his posts daily.

 
 
Sun, 11/27/2011 - 9:28am
QMaster8 Says:
 
 
Sat, 12/03/2011 - 6:05pm

Decent points but my one criticism is that you fail to mention human ingenuity. There have been plagues, world wars, and famines throughout time but humans have always prevailed. We may be the most ignorant species but were also the most stubborn and when we put our minds to any problem, it can be solved. The will to survive will carry our species until there is some sort of unforeseeable, gigantic tragedy that wipes out everything IMO

 
 
Sat, 12/03/2011 - 6:50pm
Dankrupt Says:

I'm sure there will be pockets of humans that survive regardless of what path we end up taking, my biggest concern is with the rest of the species that live on this planet. Their survival is intertwined with ours. “Man did not weave the web of life, he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web, he does to himself." - Chief Seattle

 
 
Wed, 12/07/2011 - 7:25pm
Elnicko Says:

IDK dude, unless we can somehow stop relying on the suns energy all together(witch may be possible for a few small towns, but not modern life), humans are fucked.
But if I dropped you in the Forrest today, could you survive? Maybe with a bunch of people, and they all had sticks, but pretty damn soon one of them is gonna say, "hey, lets use a spear." Then a bow, then a sword, then a gun. Progress is in our nature, we NEED a reason to be here, and you know it just as well as I do.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 12:37am
portlund8 Says:

humans have a natural thirst for innovation and improvement; upgrading. it seems like it would be a positive thing but its really the opposite.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 2:58am

It's only negative when this upgrading is not helping life (and not just our selfish ones) to survive. Innovations like solar ovens, grey-water systems, jungle-like organic self-sustainable gardening, are positive. The important thing is to stop innovating in the private computer area of modern life, and put that energy into cleaning up the mess we've made and turning toward the principles of permaculture.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 11:01am
Dankrupt Says:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5ZgzwoQ-ao Places like this are perfect.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 11:25am

I beg to differ, there are many indigenous tribes that exist today that have not progressed with the rest of the western/ post-industrialized world. Tribes that don't have electricity, still hunt with bow & arrows and knives, and that wear simple clothing that has no connection to "fashion," but merely help with the climate they live in.

a belief the native americans had (i forgot which ones, but i read it in one of my women's studies courses) was the 7 generations rule. That for every decision made, one must think about how it will affect their descendants/ tribe 7 generations in the future.

 
 
Wed, 12/14/2011 - 1:59am

The sins of the fathers are visited on the children onto the seventh generation.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 2:51am

Found by James Lovelock and Lynn Margulis, the Gaia hypothesis states that the earth is a self-organized system that developed over 4000 million years. That’s a mighty long time to come into being, and longer still compared to how long it has taken us to nearly destroy it. The happy ending for this system is not a happy one for us, however. This whole-system science also proclaims that if we affect the fundamental life-support systems we will be “neutralized” by co-evolutionary mechanisms. These mechanisms are things like weather or disease.
- Permaculture; Principles & pathways Beyond Sustainability, p.3

 
 
Mon, 12/12/2011 - 10:32am
Dankrupt Says:

US military warns of peak oil by 2015. Global warming irreversible by 2017. Ice free north pole by 2015.

 
 
Mon, 12/12/2011 - 11:49pm

Read Paul gilding's -The Great Disruption- way better Ideas.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 6:11am
Dankrupt Says:
 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 11:12am
 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 12:03pm
Dankrupt Says:
 
 
Fri, 12/23/2011 - 5:05pm
 
 
Wed, 01/04/2012 - 2:40am
Dankrupt Says:

*That you're fuckin' retarded.
Kind of sad I have to help you call me mentally challenged.

US production peaked in 1970. I am talking about global oil production. Check out the documentary "A Crude Awakening / The Oil Crash"

 
 
Sat, 12/10/2011 - 1:24am
Dankrupt Says:

http://deepgreenresistance.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/01-Aric-McBay.mp3 Aric McBay on Deep Green Resistance and how to effectively organize and fight back.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 3:13am
MoLTReZ Says:

i love the mindset you have , don't get me wrong. Your head/soul is in the right spot. But we don't have to go to a hunter-gatherer societies.We can be farmers , we can have business, we can have SIMPLE electricity and power.We don't have to go all iron age to have a normal/happy/rich/smooth running nation.
The whole reason we are in this fuck hole we call America is
1.)The rich republican policies
2.) Like you said the rich fuck over this amazing earth for short term gains and profits
3.) the people not ALL bonding together to overthrow the fucked up government we have set up.
4.) as a whole the people of this nation are stupid, they don't they for themself, they follow whatever someone of higher power tells them. They believe the half truths and republican propaganda for the truth. ( Don't believe me look at our last president )
5.) We don't read books anymore. Plain and simple. I get most of my knowledge from books. Not whatever i see on T.V aka lies
6.) We don't question the system as much as we such. We should doing more then the stoners of the 60s-70s. they knew what was up.
7.) Religion . after you let go of that your mind truly does open up.

Now i can rant on and on about the social ills of this nation , but i only need those 7 sidenotes to kind of sum up the idea

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 4:42am
Dankrupt Says:

I'm not against farming altogether, humans have been farming for tens of thousands of years, the farming I'm against is macro-agriculture: making more food than you actually need. A tiny, tiny portion of one culture on one corner of the world decided to practice macro-agriculture, this led to population growth, which meant more land had to be used to grow their surplus of food. As more land was taken, more food was produced, and more people were born. After generations this tiny culture had grown so large that it was impeding on other human cultures surrounding it, forcing them to either join the Macroagriculturalist way of life, or be forced off of their native land so that the Macroagriculturalists could continue to grow.

Thousands of years pass. Sustainable culture after sustainable culture are wiped out as they are either sucked into the Macroagriculturalist machine as workers, or eliminated through force so that they would not get in the way. The Romans expanding into Europe, the Spanish expanding into South America, the Americans expanding into the West, the British expanding into Australia… all while exterminating the Gauls, the Mayans, the Comanches and the Aborigines…

These are not separate examples of historical events. This is the same culture repeating the same genocide time and time again. And it’s still happening.

You say we can still have simple electricity, but the use of electricity would still require all the destructive mining processes for copper wiring and the like.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 5:19am
MoLTReZ Says:

i couldn't agree with you more on the genocide every great nation has mistaken for growth in their empire. But at the same time growth is good for a empire , it just can't get out of hand and let it grow like a cancer. Now about the Macro-agriculturalists you are totally spot on about that. The only thing i would add would be the lack of reasonably with the farming which led to the surplus of food and like you stated un-controllable growth. If they had a laid out a plan for the farming i believe that it would greatly cut down on the surplus of food. They over-stocked in the spring and summer to save up for the long&cold winters(so people wouldn't die).

Now i am so sure about the British and Australia ? I tent to believe they took it over as a huge resource for goods and land. Also they used it to sent away anyone in jail or that questioned the crown.

Well yes we would have to mine for copper but we have tons of pennies made out of copper to last us until we can create or design a better way to transfer electricity.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 11:25am
Dankrupt Says:

The health of the planet should be primary, not our little empires. Everything we do should be aimed at improving the land we live on.

Why do you want to keep electricity so badly? Is it really so vital to your existence?
"Isn't this enough? Just this world? Just this beautiful, complex, wonderfully unfathomable world? How does it so fail to hold our attention that we have to diminish it with the invention of cheap, man-made Myths and Monsters?" Tim Minchin

As long as people continue with the thinking that nature is resources, we will have significant problems. View the natural world and its inhabitants as things to enter into symbiotic relationships with. Give and take.

Also, how exactly do you impose this solution you are suggesting? Sure, its a good idea, but I doubt it will be implemented before its too late... There’s a strategy that’s very accessible to us. We shouldn’t be waiting for our ‘leaders’ (who are clearly bringing us in the opposite direction than we should be heading, because they are motivated primarily by profit and not the wellbeing of people and the planet) to start drastically cutting carbon emissions. Decisive ecological warfare.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 3:50am
CamBam. Says:

I wish people would listen. This is a great highdea, although I agree with Moltrez about the fact that we don't have to revert as far as hunter-gatherer colonies to live efficiently. But people have grown accustomed to living a life of overabundance, and I don't know if it would be possible to convince everyone to give up all the technology and civilization that we have now.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 10:25am
Dankrupt Says:

Here's the thing, we don't need to(and won't) convince most of them. We just have to fight like hell. Just like I'm not convincing many of you to give up civilization, it won't stop me from resisting against it.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 12:35pm
CamBam. Says:

How do you propose we fight then? Petitions and speeches do nothing for us, protesting gets us all pepper sprayed and locked up. What else should we do? (btw, idk if this sounds sarcastic or rude so this is a disclaimer that I am not trying to be either of those lol)

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 1:02pm
Dankrupt Says:

Decisive ecological warfare.

The abovegrounders would work to build sustainable and just communities wherever they were, and would use both direct and indirect action to try to curb the worst excesses of those in power, to reduce the burning of fossil fuels, to struggle for social and ecological justice. Meanwhile, the undergrounders would engage in limited attacks on infrastructure (often in tandem with aboveground struggles), especially energy infrastructure, to try to reduce fossil fuel consumption and overall industrial activity. The overall thrust of this plan would be to use selective attacks to accelerate collapse in a deliberate way, like shoving a rickety building.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 3:04pm
CamBam. Says:

Alright, I like where you're going with this. That was a great article, I read most of it and got the idea of what they want done. But these attacks that they refer to, do they mean physically attacking companies and their projects? That's what I'm taking away from it. They want us to sabotage anything that is detrimental to the Earth, and that makes sense to me. Have they started an underground or above ground resistance party yet or are they just hoping enough people will agree with this and help form the parties?

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 3:48pm
Dankrupt Says:

You got it right. You can contact them through the site to get involved. You may want to start your own chapter of an above ground movement in your area as this is a fairly new movement, only about 6 months old. The underground groups are not talked about but I'm positive there are individuals already out there waiting for some opportunities. I heard about one small group of people sabotaging a rail road which caused a disruption for a couple days (wasn't a derailment or anything, they just made the tracks think there was a train stopped on them when there wasn't) Read the security culture link I put in my first comment on this highdea, or click on the security tab on the website.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 3:55am
Infinitum Says:

I think you'd appreciate this. There is still potential

"Think outside the cell"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_oUqxkse_E&feature=player_embedded

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 1:51pm

I can't take it anymore....are things screwed up in this world? Yes; no argument from me on this one.

Should we begin to change the world so that our future generations can fully enjoy this place like we have? Yes, again, no argument from me.

You can't just go spouting off your ideas on highdeas and think that you are a superior person; you have to be your ideas. Do you use electricity? You typed your thoughts on a keyboard and then logged in through an internet connection to post them. Are you driving a car in your profile picture? Do you wear expensive clothes(or retail chain apparel) to make you look better? Hope that is not in front of your house because I see a central air system in the background. How is the new call of duty game on xbox? I know not all of these will apply to you but some of them do. Sorry to make assumptions but I am trying to get my point across.

Until you can change everything you are and are going to commit to it 100% (which you haven't by the way), then you are no better than the rest of civilization. Your idea is just an idea and will remain a simple idea until you make it an action.

We pull society along and society pulls us along. Until you break free from this tug-o-war, you are not qualified to tell everyone else to.

And to address your cancer comment, most people these days pull through cancer because of technological advances developed by civilizations. They see each day as a gift due to coming face to face with their own endings.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 2:20pm
Dankrupt Says:

If I were to throw away everything civilization gives me, I would not be a very effective fighter of civilization. In fact, I wouldn't be able to do shit about civilization. Here's a question: If you are fighting a war and you come across an enemy weapon, do you leave it where it lays because it would be hypocritical of you to use the weapon? No, you don't. Stupid fucking argument.

I am committed 100% to where I'm taking my life, this doesn't mean that the moment I decided to fight against civilization I should have just went out as fast as I could and made stupid decisions that ultimately would have had little impact on the overall picture. Eco warriors need to be strategic.

We don't have modern medicine for the whole planet, so your cancer comment is ultimately useless. Also, our longer lifespans are a major contributor to how unsustainable this way of life is. (Incase you didn't see the metaphor, which I wouldn't at all be surprised, I was comparing civilization to cancer.)

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 2:58pm

This is the typical "do as I say, not as I do" argument.

I will use all these weapons to spread my cause, but you guys don't need to. What if every "fighter" was like you? Man, the oil we would burn trying to get everyone to stop burning oil would be outrageous.

In all honesty, I am glad that you are 100% commited to where you are taking your life. We need more people who are 100% commited to things in this world....too many people are 55% commited; only enough to fool the general population. Don't do things half-assed, do them full-assed.

I don't feel like arguing anymore, this is not a place for that. I disagree with your tactics and stated why. If you truely want to change the world by destroying civilization, more power to you. Use what you need to get the job done. Personally, I would lead by example; different strokes for different folks.

P.S. I knew exactly where you were going with the cancer analogy. I just wish you would have chosen a better verbal tool than cancer to move your audience. I know how cancer turns out for most people, they make it through now with treatment. It makes your closing statement look weak. Compare civilization to the Nazi's or something. No one liked those idiots and look at how much better the world became when they were defeated.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 4:00pm
Dankrupt Says:

What I'm telling people to do and what I'm doing are one in the same. What I am doing right now is getting the word out, a vitally important part of the process, and I encourage everyone to use social media to spread awareness of the problem.

Typical "be the change you wish to see in the world" argument. Environmentalists have been using pacifist tactics since the movement began, and it has been tremendously ineffective. Derrick Jensen wrote 900 pages (inEndgame) to refute the pacifist arguments generally accepted across the left. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e75I4ysssoA Here's a short video. (10 min) Idk if your a pacifist, but I figure why not share.

Realistically though, the amount of oil any guerrilla fighter uses (which would be minuscule comparison to civilizations daily use) would be pretty much instantly justified after their first effective action that slowed oil production.

I'll give you a Nazi comparison if you want one...

"One of the smartest things the Nazis did was to co-opt rationality and to co-opt hope. The way they did that was by making it so that at every step of the way it was in the Jews’ rational, best interest not to resist.

Would you rather get an ID card or would you rather resist and possibly get killed? Do you want to go to a ghetto or do you want to resist and possibly get killed? Do you want to get on a cattle car or do you want to resist and possibly get killed? Do you want to take a shower or do you want to resist and possibly get killed?

Every step of the way, it was in their rational best interest to not resist. But I’ll tell you something really interesting: The Jews who participated in the Warsaw ghetto uprising had a much higher rate of survival than those who went along. We need to keep that in mind over the next ten years." - Derrick Jensen

 
 
Wed, 12/14/2011 - 9:19am
Dankrupt Says:

"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom and yet depreciate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters."

"Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress." Frederick Douglass

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 4:08pm

"we can bomb the world to pieces but we can't bomb it into peace"

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 4:35pm
Dankrupt Says:

We will never achieve peace with this exploit and consume culture. It requires the importation of resources, and since they can't get all their resources from their own land base, they have to go out and take it from other people. Watch the video in the comment above yours. You know why pacifism is so loved by those in power? Because they can ignore you and keep on exploiting and consuming.

Good luck trying to use peaceful means as a way to stop them. You'll be just as successful as those who tried to use peaceful means to stop Hitler. And just as effective as attempting to stop Ted Bundy by peaceful means.

 
 
Tue, 12/13/2011 - 7:45pm

Finally the highDEA Ive been waiting for my whole life!

 
 
Thu, 12/15/2011 - 11:21am

If I could upvote this a million times, I would.

 
 
Thu, 12/15/2011 - 6:06pm
Thingone Says:

I didn't realize Adolf had a highDEA's account

 
 
Thu, 12/15/2011 - 6:28pm
Dankrupt Says:

Lawl, Seems you have a lot to learn about Adolf Hitlers ideas. I'll just leave this random, somewhat relevant quote here.

"Before our white brothers came to civilize us we had no jails. Therefore we had no criminals. You can’t have criminals without a jail. We had no locks or keys, and so we had no thieves. If a man was so poor that he had no horse, tipi or blanket, someone gave him these things. We were too uncivilized to set much value on personal belongings. We wanted to have things only in order to give them away. We had no money, and therefore a man’s worth couldn’t be measured by it. We had no written law, no attorney or politicians, therefore we couldn’t cheat. We were in a really bad way before the white man came, and I don’t know how we managed to get along without the basic things which, we are told, are absolutely necessary to make a civilized society." - John Lame Deer

 
 
Wed, 01/18/2012 - 4:03am

Cutting off the advancement of the Human society in a whole will only, destroy the only thing that sets us apart from animals as a sentiment being. Capable of complex thoughts and emotions. I truly believe that we stand a chance of furthering our knowledge and our civilization. Dr. Michio Kaku once said that the human race is a Class 0 Civilization, meaning we aren't even a planetary society, capable of producing our resources from substance without harming our planet. Which is 100% correct. Now, does that mean we will not evolve as our ancestors before us have? Absolutely not, but it's no certainty that we will. But, who are we to give up on ourselves before we've even given it a proper chance. I was always taught that if you can improve the world do so. Take risk's if necessary to do so. But to never give up.
Why give up on our future? You're children's future, or their children's future? Just because some oppression came a long, because some corruptness in the system came along? That happened to Michael D'angelo and Leonardo Da Vinci. Had, they have given up we'd have no great art or medicine. To truly prosper, we need to research everything possible. Astrophysics being a key component. Astrophysics could allow us to be able to derive new fuels to feed off that have no harsh consequences, like dark matter. The large hydron-collider in Sweden is working on that at the moment, but because of improper funds they are way behind schedule.
The proof is in the pudding, but, just because some hurdles are in the way, we shouldn't just give up. There's to little known about our universe to even give us a shot at accomplishing a major evolution in our society.

 
 
Wed, 01/18/2012 - 6:56am
Highwalker Says:
 
 
Thu, 10/31/2013 - 2:45am